Safe Speed Forums

Unfortunately a sixth died today.

The met have been doing an enforcement drive at three sites around London. Cyclists and lorries have been their targets.

http://www.lbc.co.uk/police-catching-cyclists-who-break-the-law-81518

Six deaths in 2 weeks. Would this have anything to do with the clocks going back?

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

That article is not very useful, while hundreds of cyclists may have been stopped there is no indication how many were committing offences or just not wearing a helmet. They give this information for HGVs so why not the cyclists?

The rise in the number of cyclists is often mentioned in reports, I wonder if there is a "born again biker" effect at play here?

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Driving fast is for a particular time and place, I can do it I just only do it occasionally because I am a gentleman.
- James May

Er, no.

Cyclists weren't being stopped for offences, the police were stopping those not wearing helmets or hi viz and advising them to do so.

I must say that after the recent spate of deaths, the police spending time going out and telling cyclists they should be wearing a high viz jacket is laughable, and they have been roundly criticised.

The Standard has a slightly different angle on this.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/h ... 46997.html

Police said they identified 60 offences in just 20 vehicles that were stopped.

Who's the problem?




Er, no. Some very experienced cyclists have been killed recently, so no.

Better reporting on that, thanks, given that the 60 offences were on 10 vehicles or maybe 15, it is perhaps even worse.






Presumably they were not caught by left turning lorries though, no experienced cyclist would ride up the inside of a lorry at a junction surely? Actually you should not pass anything at or approaching a junction, left or right, basic survival technique that applies to both push and motor cycles.

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Driving fast is for a particular time and place, I can do it I just only do it occasionally because I am a gentleman.
- James May

The guy that got caught by a left turning lorry today was 60, I imagine he's a life long cyclist, as many his age would be. We don't know what happened yet, speculation is that the lorry pulled right and then swung left, but he must've already passed the cyclist right?

Cyclists don't necessarily ride up inside a left turning lorries, lorry drivers drive up beside cyclists and turn left too.

I was riding along the Strand once and a very long lorry overtook, I was immediately on edge and dropped back, a taxi was hooting behind me, I'd stopped and the lorry swung across me. Had I been a few feet further forward it would've taken me out with it's back wheels so only my action avoided death or serious injury. To add, whilst alongside me I couldn't see it's indicators. I think he must expected me to stop, or maybe he didn't see me at all, or had seen me, but when I was out of his vision he'd forgotten I was there.

Brian Dorling was. A very experienced cyclist. He had jumped a light (speculation is that he did it to get away from a lorry that had pulled up next to him). The lorry jumped the light too and turned left crushing Mr Dorling to death.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-23424735

My stars, I hadn't read that LBC article.

What an unmitigated pile of toss.

It implies that cycling without a helmet or hi-viz is illegal.

Only briefly mentions that 20 lorry drivers and their vehicles stopped counted for 60 offences,

Now you understand what I meant, it mixes together stopping hundreds of cyclists with stopping HGVs and finding offences.

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Driving fast is for a particular time and place, I can do it I just only do it occasionally because I am a gentleman.
- James May

Mentally I had put this down to drivers not realising the cyclist was there rather than completely ignoring them, especially given how many there are.

I have had to cope with the classic overtake, pull left and slam the brakes on enough times, so turning left before even finishing an overtake should not be surprising. Thanks for explaining that in a non-contentious way.

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Driving fast is for a particular time and place, I can do it I just only do it occasionally because I am a gentleman.
- James May

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

I don't this is news for anyone on this thread!

Maybe not, but this Youtube video of it does demonstrate it very nicely!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... zL0Kyk4m-8

I've been wondering whether "Fixing the problem" surely has to be better than apportioning blame after the event! To that end, I've been wondering about some sort of "proximity sensor" system whereby the truck (bus) is fitted with a array of (what I imagine would be quite cheap) proximity sensors around its perimeter. These days, it's common for coaches to be fitted with several cameras looking in blind spots where the mirrors can't "see", but of course, there's no guarantee that the driver will be watching the right one at the right time. If there could be some sort of "proximity sensor" that (say) creates a field for about 5m all round the lorry, and transponders on the cyclist that could "beep" at the driver whenever they entered the 5m zone, that might at least get his attention (although in very cyclist / pedestrian-dense areas, it might end up going off continuously! Perhaps a further refinement (though an additional level of complexity too) could be to limit it to (say) steering angle sensor, road speed signal etc) so that it could "tailor" the zone to the most critical areas (e.g. when turning left, it could only activate the "zone" down the left hand side of the trailer and at full-lock, maybe activate the zone round the very back, where the trailer overhang is likely to swing out) etc? Maybe reduce the size of the "zone" as road speed decreases?

I'm sure that the transponders on the cyclists could be relatively cheap and low-powered too. They're really only have to work at very close range.

The YouTube film is very interesting. I note the lorry actually seems to have its left indicator on.

One of the comments sums up my view:

"All this video does is make cyclists look like idiots. I am sorry but who in there right mind would come up the inside of a lorry that is indicating left? Basic road rules..."

I disagree with Mole here. You don't need a technological solution to this. You need a training and commonsense solution. Just for a change, can cyclists do something sensible for their own good instead of expecting others to always make the effort for them?

The suggestion from some to ban trucks in the rush hour is also impractical given they are already restricted in doing overnight deliveries in some areas.

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

I had one incident today - I saw a cyclist in the inside climbing a hill , but NOT indicating a right turn.Yards later I heard a shout. I'd
apparently cut him up .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on