Safe Speed Forums

I had one take exception to my headlamp flash recently - doing about 60 on a DC on outside lane, about to pass slower cars in inside -this numpty in inside lane, no indication pulled out about a cars length in front of me still going slower than me causing me to hit the brakes .I flashed headlamps and got a lot of gestures from rear seat and waving of camera phones - trouble there were 3 of them and only me - now if they had made a formal complaint 3 of them against me - who would the police believe ?? possibly me , but would the agro be worth it?

I get your point and don’t get me wrong, I wouldn’t go out of my way to flash somebody or to try and intimidate them. I do it to try and give them some warning, After all you can get a ticket for leaving them on. If they start showing any kind of road rage then I’d drop back. As somebody who’s been driving for a considerable amount of time (not giving my age away) I’ve seen fair amount of road rage and I’ve learned to deal with it.

_________________
Useless laws weaken necessary laws.

That depends on where you live. I live by the sea in south Cornwall where fog, sea mist, low cloud etc is a common feature of the local climate. It is usually a highly localised phenomenon. You can be in a thick pea-souper one minute and then into good visibility the next. In the cooler months of the year I find myself using the rear fogs frequently. I agree they are irritating when you are following someone mile after mile in good visibility, but you can't blame people for leaving them on when the visibility can change so suddenly. Under such conditions, I would rather they left them on in the clear sections than not have them on at all. After all, around here with so many visitors unfamiliar with the roads, they really can be a lifesaver.

Dixie - this was only a quick flash to wake em up and hopefully get them to realise the danger. Like you been on road long enough to walk away from road rage - my first licence was a yearly one in a red book.
But this got me thinking about how easy it would be to be accused of road rage when in the right.

1. Forgetting they're on; anyone here driven a new Mini? Where both foglight switches and lights are really small, and on the central console. A design classic.

2. Driving round with front foggies and sidelights only. WHY??? What does this achieve, apart from being the equivalent of a flashing neon "I'm a wretched chav" sign?

3. Heard a great idea a few years back. Built-in 50mph speed limiter with front fogs on, 40mph for rear foggies. People would soon remember then...

That is the best idea I have heard about! Not practical for implementation though unless the limiter is installed for an alternative reason... and we don't want that.

That's what we've got "effing" switches for!!! If they can't see the 'fog lamp' indicator on your dash, and so switch it off when not required - are they competent enough as human beings to be out driving...

Your logic is akin to sounding your horn and flashing the hazards permanently 'cos "you never know when you'll actually need them, so best just toot & flash all the time....."

Following your logic, if they can't see the speedometer and so adjust their speed to be within the speed limit - are they competent enough as human beings to be out driving...

you've not been paying attention, have you?

I'm not saying that is my point of view! I'm just demonstrating the flawed logic of the poster I was replying to.

there's nothing flawed at all. I think we are all perfectly capable of staring at our speedos and making sure we never exceed the speed limit. It wouldn't make us safer drivers though.

We are not talking about people who rely on external references & sources for their driving skills and so maintain a safe / legal speed. THIS IS WHY THE MUPPETS HAVE REAR FOG LAMPS ON IN GOOD VISIBILITY IN THE FIRST PLACE, as they do not respond to external stimuli, eg. Other road user flashing them, the unusal red glow from all of the signs they pass when looking in rear view, the 'warning' lamp on the dashboard. So by inference, what makes you think that THEY can hold a legal,not saying safe as your post stated 'within the speed limit', speed with no visual cues or references including not being able to see the speedometer? Most (decent) drivers are actually aware of their surroundings & obtain visual & audio cues to anticipate and adjust their driving accordingly, so (tongue firmly in cheek) - are these unobservant drivers competent enough as human beings to be out?...

Some cars have very poor warning lamps though, I remember a Ford Escort I had had only a small pin prick of a light that was well below eye level.

Not saying this excuses it, but it's something that doesn't help on some cars.

Put like that, I agree with you entirely. My point, originally, was that in some parts of the country, under conditions of patchy low visibility which is quite common, you might be following a driver who doesn't turn off his or her rear fogs in places where visibility is good. That shouldn't make him or her a bad driver, nor should it irritate the following driver. If the visibilty becomes generally good for a distance with no further signs of sudden deterioration, like vehicles coming the other way without their front or rear fogs on, then sure, the driver should be aware of that and turn them off.

I'm glad we're agreed!!

Yes, patchy fog with some breaks - no problems with seeing someone keeping them on until they clear it.
I just strongly resent the drivers exhibiting 'duh, fog lights, what fog lights?', 'keep them on just incase, better safe than sorry', or 'screw everbody else, I don't have to look at it!'


Ah, peace is returned to the sanctum....

Until today (when I took delivery of a shiny new 137hp Transit...oh, baby), my delivery van was a VW LT van, which had no warning light when fog light was on and an easily accidentally pressed switch. It did have a beeper which sounded if you left the lights on.

Occasionally I would turn the lights off, the beep wouldn't stop and I would realise I had kneed the switch at some point on my journey and been blinding other drivers ever since. Oh, ignominy!

So if you follow an LT with rear fog light on, they probably can't tell!

It is a type approval requirement that fog lights are self canceling when the ignition or lights are turned off. Thats why they are momentary (not latching} switches on new cars. That way idiots cannot leave them on all the time.

This has been the case for the past 7 years or so.

It is interesting that in some countries (like Japan) Fog lights are illegal under any circumstances. Cars do not have them.

_________________
Speed camera policy Kills

This is so for rear fogs, but not fronts. I know not why.

I think I've only used mine once, very briefly in three years.

Agree though, there is nothing worse that some dopey half wit driving round with them on.

The same ones who leave the indicators on etc etc

Generally the same ones who have poor lane discipline but religously stick to the speed limit.

Forgive my stereotyping.

Love them and loathe them, lots of numpty's around here drive with them on and sidelights only, but there are lots of unlit country lanes and they do help especially pickingh up the verge where often the road merges with little definition, but as soon as I see car lights let alone a car they go off.

_________________
Gordon Brown saying I got the country into it's current economic mess so I'll get us out of it is the same as Bomber Harris nipping over to Dresden and offering to repair a few windows.

Chaos, panic and disorder - my work here is done.

http://www.wildcrafts.co.uk