Safe Speed Forums

Why can't they move dangerous crossings to safer locations?

Cheers
Peter

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Only when ideology, prejudice and dogma are set aside does the truth emerge - Kepler

But unless it is compulsory to use crossings, then a jaywalking law is pointless.

I routinely cross a busy A-road within 50 yards of a signalised crossing, because there is a central refuge and I am confident I can judge the traffic safely. I would find it objectionable to be forced to use that crossing.

In reality, a jaywalking law could only apply in designated areas (probably the centres of large towns and cities) where crossings were provided at very frequent intervals. To be honest, I don't see how such a law could be either enforceable or effective.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

can't remember seeing one of those, seen quite a few close misses where the cyclist is coming up the nearside of slow traffic like a polais missile and nearly cops it when a car slows to let a right turner cross in front of him.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

I don't really see why, we have a law against careless driving that works pretty well, why not an equivalent law against carelessly walking in front of traffic?

But a general law against "careless walking" is very different to a strict liability jaywalking law, which is what some folks seem to want.

And, in practice, a law against "careless walking" would only tend to be applied when someone was lying in a hospital bed, when it could be construed as adding insult to injury.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Wouldn't it send a message of responsibility? In a rather similar way to the benefit you espoused for the hand held mobile phone ban?

I can't say I'm much of a fan of the idea of using the law to send a message (in either instance), but I'm a big fan of any method that effectively sends messages of responsibility to road users of all classes.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

that's more or less the same thing. Either way, the cyclist can't see the car 'flash' and so has no warning of a car turning across and the person turning can't see the cyclist. The only person who can see both is the idiot doing the flashing.

Exactly, it would certainly make me think twice!! Again, when I was in the States, I was ever mindful of the jaywalking law. I know that they have 6 lane roads and that their crash record over there isn't that great, nevertheless, it provided the pedestrian with a little more responsibility than they have there.

Mind you, they also have visible policing (prevention) which appears lacking in this country. That isn't a swipe at the BiB here, more an indication of what meddling has done to the service as a whole.

It might do - but a law that in practice was only applied against people who had been splatted by motor vehicles would not look very good.

If the HC said "Pedestrians MUST NOT enter the roadway when it would require a vehicle to change its course or speed" it would in practice make zero difference to pedestrian behaviour.


Yes, the message that all road users have a responsibility for their own safety is a vital one that we tend to lose sight of.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

t's not the same thing- a car that has overtaken should be aware of the cyclist, wheras one flying down the nearside is creating his own hazard.

ever heard of a blind spot?

speaking as someone whose done a bit of cycling in the past if I would expect people not to account for me if I'm overtaking on the nearside, it's called harzard perception and taking personal responcibilty for my own safety. however I'm also a driver and am used to being both legally accountable for my actions and trained to operate the vehicle i drive to a degree of competance and compliance with road traffic laws.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

you were trained before this government got in... the kids are now taught blairs way.... thet the car is to blame... no matter what. drink as much as you can, cross any where, dont look because you can allways claim on thier insuance or the criminal injuries board if they dont stop....

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

Surely keeping well to the left as a driver - particularly after passing a cycle (having seen him in the rear view, ie not cutting the rider up) is the best way of avoiding any conflict if, in heavy traffic, you are going to stop clear of a side road on your left and allow one or more vehicles coming toward you to take the turn?

I can certainally believe that. TBH though i think the majority are okay, it's just this hardcore that seem to think all other road traffic should and WILL give way. I had one mouthing off at me the other day cos just as I was about to turn left in the turn-left lane/bus lane he decided to pass me on the nearside to go straight on. not content with the fact that due to my reactions he wasn't underneath a 2 ton MPV he had the audacity to shout at me as he flashed past my nudgebars by inches. I mean fer christ sake what gives?

You just get this kind of "I'm more politically correct so therefore I'm automatically in the right" vibe off them. yeah okay mate, tell it to st peter when your presumptuousness gets you turned to marmarlade.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

Unless, of course, the flasher had been standing for quite a while - as is likely in heavy traffic - and so had no knowledge of the cyclist.

Cheers
Peter

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Only when ideology, prejudice and dogma are set aside does the truth emerge - Kepler

so even if the cyclist is in his own lane then he has to expect people to tell others to run him down?


so now we want to deliberately impede the progress of another road user.
That's nice. What was IG saying about the reason CM is considered a terrorist gathering?

Wouldn't it be better to indicate to the oncoming traffic that it is NOT safe to proceed?


that's really not an excuse - you should still be using your mirrors before waving someone past you.

How often do you look in your mirrors while you're standing in stationary traffic? And the once that you do look in the mirror to check before flashing someone, how can you be sure that there isn't now a cyclist alongside you?
I'm not saying that it's right, but these things can happen.

Cheers
Peter

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Only when ideology, prejudice and dogma are set aside does the truth emerge - Kepler

well, yes. i mean, it's easy to knock a cyclist off yourself, but to co-ordinate it so someone else unwittingly does, that takes a litttle more skill, judgement and planning.

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Fear is a weapon of mass distraction

I check my mirrors just as often in stationary traffic as when I'm moving. Double check before moving off. Shoulder check before turning. I know when approaching an intersection whether I've passed a bike and won't flash someone if that's the case. If someone is going to turn in front of me then I always check my mirrors to make sure it's clear. If not then a quick blast of the horn (warns both parties) and a stop hand signal. It's not just for cyclists, you could just as easily be on a 3 or 4 lane road and the car doing the turn could be about to turn in front of another motor vehicle.
These things can happen but this site is all about improving driver training, not shrugging stupidity off with 'shit happens' excuses.

You'll be staying after school for some remedial lessons

All the above posts prove, that it is the motorists who are expected to be the good guys and watch out for everybody else. We have talk about cyclists undertaking in cycle lanes and yet the car or truck still has to look out for them, even though the cyclist has a far better view than a driver would. much of cycling is common sense and I don't beleive that training would make much difference, in many cases bloodymindedness plays a key part.

When I cycle I take into consideration other road users, whether it be pedestrians or overwise, I know that my life and others depend upon using concise judgement. I also know, that irrespective of cycle lanes etc, if I attempt to undertake a wagon whilst he is turning left, then there's a good chance that i'm going to end up under his wheels. The problem is that suspicion will always fall upon the wagon driver or other motorist.

Whilst I certainly agree with and accept the principles of COAST etc, can the motorist really be expected to take responsibility for all other road users actions? especially from the rear. When does such a responsibility begin to impede the quality of the motorists own driving?

Because this Government has done such a great job of implementing an 'us and them' mentality between various road users, invariably it is all road users whom suffer as a result. Because of their transportation cockups and in an attempt at getting more people to walk, cycle or use motorcycles, there has been a culture of wet nursing and concessions to hardline lobbying groups whose interests most certainly are political rather than that of the interests of he road user.

That is why we aren't seeing a decrease in fatalities or serious injury etc, essentially the road safety policy in this country is in stalemate!