Safe Speed Forums

We've just purchased a scooter for me to use for commuting since there's a free secure motorcycle rank with CCTV at my university campus and I felt like I learnt a lot about road safety and bike handling with the CBT (the former not being such a huge problem since I've had my full car license for a couple of years). However, one thing that was only briefly mentioned on the CBT was filtering through traffic when the queues are stationary.

On my route to uni each day I can take 2 roads, both of which are the same in terms of traffic volume/distance/speed.

As an example, the first is a 2-lane road that has a large roundabout with a left exit and straight on exit -- people use the left lane to use the 1st exit left, and the right approach lane to go straight on. At the roundabout on the right side there is a "keep left" island a couple of car lengths long.

This morning, as expected, the tailback for the "straight on" right-hand lane went back a long way (don't know how far, it's about a fifteen minute car crawl).

Not wanting to wait in the queue (even though I had time) and since there's loads of room between the two lanes of traffic, I went down the middle and eventually just had to butt back into the right-hand straight-on lane by stopping near the roundabout, veering to the right and sticking my front wheel in front of the most biddy-ish looking car there was room near; however, this gap was only about four feet and I basically had to wait on the goodwill of the lady driver I'd butted in front of letting me back in. She probably called me all names under the sun anyway, though, because she didn't really have much choice in the matter, and *don't* like annoying other drivers!

Questions:

Can someone give me advice on filtering through traffic? I've looked at: http://www.motorcycle-tuition.com/motor ... ring.shtml which pretty much goes over what was said on my CBT, but the line "Can you rejoin the traffic ahead?" is always a NO on my route -- the tailbacks go so far back each day that no one leaves more than half a car length between themselves and the car in front, which means it's impossible for me to filter back in unless i just cross my fingers and hope Mrs. Jones in her Nissan is feeling in a good mood!

I thought of just sitting back and forgetting about filtering through traffic, but these queues I sit in are so ripe for taking advantage of because of the wide roads...

Firstly, welcome to the forum!

Filtering has been discussed in some length here, so have a look there too. I have a couple of years experience riding bigger bikes (i took direct access so I never had to ride smaller ones) and the one over-riding fact you must keep in mind is that car drivers are generally complete idiots who are not looking at what's going on around them, and more often than not resent the fact that you're passing them. CBT has to be a little PC to avoid causing too much bad blood between bikers and drivers. DAS on the other hand isn't...

The first piece of advice I will offer is in my opinion you'd be wise to ditch the scooter and buy a 'proper' bike. I know that's a bit late since you've already spent out for the scooter now, but the reason I say this is that scooters have absolutely no road presence at all, and the majority of drivers will assume that you're just some spotty little kid who isn't old enough to drive yet, and as a result will treat you with utter contempt. Whilst a 125cc bike isn't the biggest of machines, its still more visible and has better presence that a scooter.

Until you get a bit more confident it might be worth considering staying in the queue - I do understand that that was the whole reason for getting a bike in the first place, but filtering is probably the single most dangerous thing you can do on two wheels. Not only are you at risk from cars changing lanes without signalling / looking, which is more common that you might imagine, but you are at the mercy of someone deciding to open a door into your path as well. The most important thing is to watch EVERY vehicle like a hawk. Try to look into the car and see where the driver is looking (its not always possible) because that might give you advanced warning that they're about to do something stupid. Also, learn to watch the 'body language' of the vehicles for signs of the same.

As for re-joining the lane before entering the roundabout, in my experience the only way is to push in. Again, that's where having a 'proper' bike can be helpful as you're more likely to be seen, and the driver is less likely to get agressive and try to block you (they will do anyway, it just helps - pointy metal bits tend to do more damage than soft plastic ). Its virtually impossible to take advantage of the ability to filter without putting a couple of noses out of joint, and if you intend to be in the saddle for any length of time you'll need to leard when to be agressive. The chances are that Mrs. Jones in her Nissan hasn't even seen you (why do I need to check my mirrors when I'm in a queue, right?) so you need to assert yourself. You need to know exactly how much room you need and how quickly you can get into a space.

The biggest thing I can suggest, if you intent to be in the saddle for a decent length of time, is to get on and take your test ASAP. You'll be amazed how much difference 200cc can make - and don't worry about the weight coz you really don't notice it with something small.

I hope that helped...I'm sure some of the other bikers round here'll contibute too.

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

It's a 102cc (Honda) scooter It's not great in terms of speed, but it's pretty big compared to the tiny 50cc one I learnt on! Unfortunatly, without any 2-wheel vehicle experience more engine power = £s++ insurance. That, coupled with my age (20) and where we live (a baaad area of Edinburgh) means I'd just about faint if I were to hear a quote for a "proper" bike from an insurer. Still, I *would* think about it once I've got some experience on a scooter and the insurance wouldn't be quite so terrifying

I'm not planning on taking my test right now -- I'll think about doing the intensive week when my CBT runs out. I'd like some road experience first Also a reason why I didn't dive straight into getting a "proper" bike was that I wasn't sure if I've even like using a 2-wheeled vehicle for commuting -- my scooter's on a trial period. In 1-2yrs I'll have figured out if I like it enough and there are enough benefits into getting into this properly; the roads I use for commuting are all 30mph roads so it's not like speed's important. (And there are 4 cameras inbetween our place and my uni, 4 or 5 miles away...! )

You've given me a lot of food for thought -- the link you posted was helpful, lots of good advice! Thanks!

Sarah Anne.

p.s. Saddened to hear there isn't some magical trick for getting back into the lanes after filtering... I'm such a considerate driver when in a car, it feels awful to just "butt in" when on a bike

You'd be surprised how expensive scooters can be to insure compared to an old tatty 125cc bike (just ran a quick quote for a 1985 Honda CM125 at my home adress and it came back as £220 TPO). But I see your point entirely.

Its a good idea to get some experience before sitting your test for sure, just be careful you don't get into bad habits!

Welcome to the world of biking and ride safe. Take your time and learn how to ride properly, and above all Be Careful!

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

Filtering is dangerous even when expected by the drivers around you. That said whats the point of a bike if you do not use its advantages.

The key thing to bear in mind with filtering is that there is an onus on you to make sure you are safe this is enshrined in case law, which even though it dates back to when all bikes were hooligans is still used against you today.

If filtering always be wary of junctions and gaps in the traffic where vehicles can turn or emerge, always keep your passing speed to such a level that a) if you crash you won't be hurt and b) any car drivers that you have passed will at least state that you were doing it with due care.

As for the roundabout. personally I would only ever filter to just behind the front car at the give way line. The front car will be so busy trying to work out the roundabout that they will not register you there. As you will be infront of the second car in the queue they will at least have no excuse not to have seen you and should let you plan your manouver.

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Former Military Police Officer and accident investigator

I find that a quick glance to establish eye-contact works (do it with a "happy face"). Once they've let you in, a quick wave or nod to say thanks and off you go.
O.K., you may have to wait a tad till someone lets you in, but someone WILL let you in, and you've still chopped loads off the queue.

Hah tried to wave to say thanks to the Mrs Jones Nissan woman this morning, ended up wobbling all over the place

Having read your responses on here, I will definitely take care when filtering, don't want any nasty accidents

Patch, I'd never even try the 2nd car in a queue... anything within about 10 or fifteen cars of the roundabout is cool by me I'm just so glad of the time short filtering chops off I have a huge grin on my face anyway

Sixty -- Norwich Union said they wouldn't insure me because of my age/postcode/being a student/lack of riding experience Bastards. They'll be clamouring for my business when I graduate and earning money. Well, this is one scooter owner that won't forget

Sarah Anne.

After a few months of riding, then you'll be in a position to take your hands off the bars of bikes that weigh 4 times more than you.
In the meantime, try "nodding" an acknowledgement instead of taking your hands off the bars.

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What makes you think I'm drunk officer, have I got a fat bird with me?

That's true - I can happily ride 100yards or so with both hands off....especially since I dropped it and bent the end of the throttle grip so it sticks

But of course I would never do something as irresponsible as that

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

Best thing about the Goldwing is its Cruise control. I managed 7 miles on the M3 without touching the bars at 70 mph

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Former Military Police Officer and accident investigator

you can signal by just lifting and straightening out your hand to raise your fingers together in a kind of wave. Works just as well and you keep a grip on the bars with your thumb, stops you wobbling.

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Speed camera policy Kills

That's discusting, I'm appauled!

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

So am I, I would NEVER admit to having a Wing

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What makes you think I'm drunk officer, have I got a fat bird with me?

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Science won over religion when they started installing lightning rods on churches.

You haven't really ridden a bike until you have successfully made a hairpin with a goldwing resting its crash bars on the ground

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Former Military Police Officer and accident investigator

I actually despatched on a W reg Goldwing for the best part of 3 months many years ago, my colleagues were convinced I was insane after watching some of the things I could make it do around the likes of Hyde Park Corner in the rush hour traffic

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What makes you think I'm drunk officer, have I got a fat bird with me?

If you are filtering through city traffic make sure you watch out for pedestrians crossing the road. They don't think about bikes either, and just stride off the pavement between the cars and straight out in front of you. They particularly like doing it in front of buses, lorries, large vans...pretty much anything too big to allow you to see them step off the pavement! The first you'll know that they've done it is when they appear in front of you, so when passing large stationary vehicles always slow down, cover the brakes and look for the suicidal pedestrian before you pass.

Edited to add: Have you thought about taking a lesson from one of the DAS instructors on how to filter? It can be taught.

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Less Kodak, more Kojak.
In times of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

Filtering rocks. Filtering on a (even slower bike than yours) rocks. Filtering past expensive cars on a gutless bike worth £300 rocks.

Some tips. Contary to popular (biker) belief car drivers arn't stupid, they haven't ridden a bike so don't understand riding one. Just like bike riders don't always understand car drivers.

Keep your wits about you,
Cover your brakes,
Open your eyes,
Ride with your lights on
when filtering look for a gap as an escape route
use bigger vehicles as shields when pulling out. Do this in your car too.
don't wave, knod.
remember most sports bikes hibernate during winter and bad weather and are ridden by big girls blouses.

no, a lot of them are just stupid.

Suspect that every other road user is an idiot, and you will be protecting yourself.

As said by all the others and expanded:
Always expect the unexpected
Continually plan an escape route - this means looking for any gap you can escape to.
Watch the mirrors - if you can see the drivers eyes they probably have seen you. If you cant see they eyes - they probably haven't
Lorries or panel vans - if you can't see their mirrors, they can't see you
Cover front and back brake at all times - at low speed if you anchor the front right up, you will be likely to fall off (you shouldn't be filtering at much more than 10mph anyway). The back brake may make you more likely to skid but its more controllable at low speed.
Find a very quiet cul-de-sac or a car park (where you won't get shouted at) and practise low speed control (again using the back brake!), figure of 8's etc until you don't wobble any more - this comes with practise and will stand you in good stead if and when you get a bigger machine.

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"Are you sh**ing me?"
"John Spartan, you are fined one credit for a violation of the verbal morality statute."