Safe Speed Forums

I have just bought a brand new vehicle (7 Miles on the clock) and am due to pick it up on Monday and was hoping for some advice on how to treat it initially as I am told to run it in gently but I was also told that 'rougher is better'.
As this is the first NEW car I have ever bought I feel I should take the time to find out.

Any advice anyone?

Oh yeah! it's a 1.6 Hdi Diesal Peugeot Partner Combi. Sorry about that but I find them ideal for my buisness and the Bentley had too small a boot.

best place to look is in your owners manual.
I think some enignes now are pre run in.

My father got a merc he was told not go above 3000rpm fro the first X miles.
My sisters boyfriend got an audi, he was not told anything about run in, nor was it in his users manual.

I think it depends on the manufacture.

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Which one since they vary from something like 75bhp to 110?

It's the 90bhp model.

I'd still run in for a 1,000 miles.

For the first hundred miles:

- no more than 50% throttle
- no more than half max rpm (if the red line is 6,500, I'd go for no more than 3,250)
- positively no labouring
- no long-term steady speeds (I might deliberately drive at 50, 60, 70, 50, 60, 70 if traffic and rpm limit permitted.)

And I'd probably do the first humdred miles on quiet roads at night. The first night - I'd want to play.

From 100 to 1,000 miles

- gradually increase max throttle from half to 3/4s
- gradually increase max rpm from half to 3/4s, keeping the upper excursions brief at first and longer later.
- positively no labouring
- no long-term steady speeds (I might deliberately drive at 50, 60, 70, 50, 60, 70 if traffic permitted.)

Then I'd change the oil and filter. Then I'd declare it 'run in'.

Many modern vehicles probably don't need this sort of faffing about at all. But I'd feel better.

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Paul Smith
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Totally agree with Paul, and indeed have just enjoyed running in the wife's new MINI Cooper along a similar regime, except....

...I don't agree about the additional oil+filter change.

Once over I would have done without a thought, but now I'm not so sure. Modern engine materials are incredibly hard and hard-wearing. Thus most manufacturers bench-run their engines to clear any initial debris / swarf, then deliberately leave the first oil fill in for a longer period and allow it to contaminate, thus promoting some degree of wear so that the engine parts actually do bed in.

If you change the oil too soon you side-step this process, and if you're not careful you end up with a car that still isn't run in properly after another 30,000 miles!

As an example, I bought my current car with 23,000 miles on the clock, and was dismayed to find that it was consuming a litre of oil every 5,000 miles. Now it's done 50,000 miles and the oil consumption has dropped back to virtually nothing. In other words it's just completed running in!

But definitely give the car an easy time over the first 1000 miles, and in particular don't let it labour. Whatever the views on bedding parts in the thing you are really trying to avoid is some new and "tight" part overheating due to excessive friction.

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Interesting. I don't think I share the same degree of faith in terms of larger particles of debris or swarf. After 1,000 miles I want them gone. The oil filter might well be significantly clogged when we need maximum oil flow for an engine that's still new.

The sort of 'polishing up' process you describe seems to me to happen well past the first 1,000 miles. Usually it'll be nicely polished up and free by 10,000 miles.

And these 'beneficial' particles you're thinking of... Do they exist on the output side of the oil filter? Do they really?

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Paul Smith
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The Peugeot HDI engines all have 12000 mile service intervals, though I think they may have an extra oil change at the first intermediate service (they have a fluid level check every 6000 miles).

As for labouring the engine, unlikely as the peak torque comes at 1750rpm

Can't find anything on the Peugeot website about running in.

I did a little research via Google on this subject not too long ago; this is entirely from memory so forgive any errors. I don’t claim to understand it all.

It used to be that engines were manufactured with a lot of uncertainty; each part must get used to working with its own particular shape, hence you had to be gentle during this period. Nowadays, engine design/manufacturing is much better understood and the tolerances are now much more controlled, so much so that the most significant issue is now piston ring seating. To reduce potential problems it is recommended to be fairly rough with new engines so that the rings form to the shape of the chamber/piston before they harden (or something like that), hence giving a better seal. It has been claimed that newer engines which have been roughly run-in benefit from better power and fuel economy.



I accept no responsibility for any loss incurred arising from the usage of the advice given, but feel free to throw some beer tokens this way if you get better mileage :c)

I think the general theory is that the filter will immediately grab any large, harmful particles, and meanwhile the oil will degrade generally and reduce it's lubricity to promote slightly higher than normal wear in order for the engine parts to bed in.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to be an authority on this, indeed I've always been a stickler for frequent oil and filter changes myself. It's just that we've had a couple of new cars over the last 3 years and having researched all the wildly conflicting views that's the theory I'm tending to go with. But it is all a bit of a black art as even car manufacturers don't seem to be able to agree on whether to run in or not.

As I said earlier, the only thing I'd really have any concerns over is the possibility of "hot-spots" due to tight clearances and excessive friction, which might happen anywhere in the engine or drive train. Light loading and a variable usage cycle in the first 1000 miles seems to me to be a sensible precaution.

And where a conflict exists, eg climbing a steep hill it's best to let the engine rev in a lower gear than labour in a higher gear.

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My Impreza has a 1000 mile run-in period and comes with a light oil that is changed at the 1000 mile service (included in purchase price). During that time you are not supposed to exceed 4000 rpm, which as I discovered lets you go up to 100 "apples", so isn't exactly slow. The 4K rev limit however doesn't let the turbo get to anything like full boost. As it was my first private purchase new car I was a very good boy and did it exactly by the book, and slowly increasing the maximum revs (and my confidence in being able to handle the thing). As others said, do what the manuafacturer says.

There are tales about those that leave a number 1111* on the forecourt when they pick up the new car... I'm not sure that I want one of those cars second hand.

* Number 11 is when you burn up the tyres from a standing start leaving two parallel black lines down the road. Being an AWD car, it can still do it (I know) but it has to be revved to about 6K and the clutch side-stepped (slide the foot off to the left rather than lifting gently) - then appreciate the smell of burning clutch and tyres...

If it makes you feel better then run it in but modern cars don't need it any more. If it has delivery milage on it it will already have been thrashed.

I have had maybe 10+ cars from new, ran most of them of over 100K. Never ever run one in.

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Very interesting thread. It's clear as mud isn't it?

I wonder if we could interest a car magazine in doing a test with real cars?

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
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I can't see how you could do much that was scientific.

My feeling is that in general modern engines are virtually immune to "wearing out", at least within the mileages they typically do; so the only thing we are aiming to affect is the possibility of some sort of catastrophic failire.

If some engine or transmission component is a bit "tight" when new, and gets exposed to harsh treatment initially then it may get very hot, in effect heat treating it and adversely affecting it's metallurgical composition. This part might fail immediately, or it might wear more rapidly than it should and fail 80,000 miles later, but either way it is possible that some failure could happen that wouldn't have happened had the vehicle been carefully run in, even though in every other respect the car showed no adverse symptoms, and the next 100 cars out of the factory might be unaffected either way.

So however

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Not to the extent of obtaining absolute final answers. But six cars with two regimes MIGHT reveal measureable differences in oil or fuel consumption.

It'd also be extremely interesting to chart fuel consumption over 10,000 miles and try and see the thing freeing up.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
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I've been fascinated to see the difference in my wife's car.

Typically I only drive it once every couple of weeks or so, and each time I've done so I've been quite suprised by how much it has freed up since the previous time. It's now done about 2,000 miles and I could still discern a difference in how it felt compared to, say, 1,500.

This is all completely subjective and un-scientific of course!

(Fuel consumption probably worsening though, due to running in being complete and using more of the rev range and performance... )

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Yes. I've been thinking about that problem. We'd need to take 'standard conditions' measurements at say 500 mile intervals. How about time to burn a precise litre at '50mph' on a dyno? <resource budget escalates...>

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

surely the manufacturers would have done this testing and be able to advise on whether running in makes any difference.
FWIW when I had a new BMW I was told (by the dealer) that running-in wasn't necessary. With my current one I had a similar experience to JT. Bought with about 25K on the clock it went through lots of oil. Now that it's being driven properly it's behaving a whole lot better.

The problem is that manufacturers have many reasons for choosing to paint a picture.

They might judge that running in may put off customers and keep quiet.

Or they might judge that running in affected warranty costs in some way.

And anyway the end of warranty is the maunfacturers' horizon. Any gains or losses that show outside of warranty would be of little interest to them but may be of big interest to customers.

Similar issues affect oil change interval recommendations too.

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Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Did anyone mention tyres and brakes -apart from leaving deposits on forecourts??

Of the hot spots and machining tolerance opinion - better to take things easy and let parts bed in gently than force the issue - you can bed in brake pads in a very short distance - just thrash the brakes --but how long will the new pads last.

Apart from that - whilst running in the car - you get the chance to get the feel of it slowly - it's new - enjoy it , especialy before some sensless idiot opens a door into it.

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