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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2007 20:55 
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diy wrote:
I haven't read the whole thread (sorry), but just wanted to pick up on the fact that magistrates are resigning over this and the magistrates association are against it.

quite serious really

Well I wouldnt be a brow beaten magistrate! un paid and they all look quite stressed. (well they are after we have bamboozeled them ) Thier bosses say convict them , hit em with big fines and they see the people they migh associate with, getting bigger fines than the pond life they thought they would be dealing with. Then there is the hopelessness of some cases (not neccessarly motoring)
I could not do it.

I had to snigger when we went through 35 cases today and they were all postponed waiting the EHCR. ... And a leeding solicitor asked ME when the judgement was due. I blagged it, told him it was 4th in the queue and was delayed due to the complex embryo case. he then spouted all this to the court as if he had perfect inside knowledge. :lol:

It did sound quite good :wink:

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


Last edited by anton on Fri Apr 20, 2007 14:33, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 14:18 
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anton wrote:
[...]hit em with big fines and they see the people they migh associate with, getting bugger fines than the pond life they thought they would be dealing with[...]

Hmmm. When did this penalty get introduced??

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 14:32 
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the day god issued me with fat fingers :lol:

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 23:30 
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orange wrote:
theboxers wrote:
Pending Cases Fifth one down. O’Halloran and Francis v. the United Kingdom


It's now advanced to 4th on the list -- at this rate, in theory we should be getting a decision about July time.


Now advanced to 3rd ... slowly but surely it's getting closer. I just hope that we win, after all the hype it'll be such a disappointment if the government win the case.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 02:00 
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orange wrote:
orange wrote:
theboxers wrote:
Pending Cases Fifth one down. O’Halloran and Francis v. the United Kingdom


It's now advanced to 4th on the list -- at this rate, in theory we should be getting a decision about July time.


Now advanced to 3rd ... slowly but surely it's getting closer. I just hope that we win, after all the hype it'll be such a disappointment if the government win the case.


If the government wins. It will prove that the Human Rights laws are not worth the paper they are written on.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 17:13 
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Judgment Day: Friday 29th June 2007 at 9:30am local time.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 18:31 
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Where did you hear that from Paul?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 18:57 
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theboxers wrote:
Where did you hear that from Paul?


From Idris Francis.

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 19:15 
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Finally! Glad to hear the long wait will soon be over.

Supposing that the government lose the case, but decide to just ignore the court and carry on as usual, is there actually anything we could do about it? Or would the ECHR decision be a reliable defence to use if you were defending a speeding case in court?


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 21:45 
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What was the end date of the ScrapCam petition again?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 21:54 
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malcolmw wrote:
What was the end date of the ScrapCam petition again?


Midnight on Tuesday 26th June.

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/scrapcam

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 22:17 
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Far be it from me to suggest that the change of end date from the 29th June to the 26th was anything other than sheer co-incidence. Surely, nobody could know the date of an ECHR judgement in advance, could they?

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 23:14 
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there will be a lot of people claiming this win/loss
SAFESPEED
ABD
PEPIPOO
SOLICITORS
LIBERTY
IDRIS
REETA CHACKRABARTI (spelling)

How are we going to play this?

A big joint event by the Thames?
guillotine a fake gatso?
(if we lose guillotine right to silence, and inocent untill proved guilty ... and justice itself) (or a funeral procession)

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 23:19 
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malcolmw wrote:
Far be it from me to suggest that the change of end date from the 29th June to the 26th was anything other than sheer co-incidence. Surely, nobody could know the date of an ECHR judgement in advance, could they?


More likley timed not to end in gordons first days :idea:

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 07:16 
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Time to change the countdown timer?


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:21 
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I suspect that this case has more to do with John Reid's statement that we may have to opt out of aspects of the ECHR than any spurious terrorist issues.

And I don't mean the implications for speed enforcement (before some lurker accuses me of getting dellusions of granduer) more to do with the creeping fixed penalty, self incrimination culture.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 13:07 
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The gov't may well lose in the ECHR. So what?
All they will do is to make the registered kEeper totally responsible for the conduct of the vehicle and if the keeper then exercises his/her newly-established right not to name the driver, then the points will just go to the keeper instead. If the keeper is a company, the fine will be much bigger, but no points will be applied.
All they will need to do is amend the NiP to say something like: "Whilst you, the keeper, are not legally required to name the driver in the form of a witness statement, by not doing so you will be responsible for the outcome of any court finding that the alleged offence was committed as if you were the driver responsible and penalised accordingly".


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 13:15 
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What happens if your car has been cloned, as that seems to be the next epidemic?

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 13:49 
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Cooperman wrote:
The gov't may well lose in the ECHR. So what?
All they will do is to make the registered kEeper totally responsible for the conduct of the vehicle and if the keeper then exercises his/her newly-established right not to name the driver, then the points will just go to the keeper instead.


I don't think so. If the ECHR is won I think we'll get a 'decriminalised' procedure with no points possible.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 14:01 
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I hope so Paul, and I admire your optimism.


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